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Myra's avatar

I have honestly failed to understand the whole vaccination strategy.

My stance initially was that the AZ-vaccine was adenovirus based, a technique used before, and therefore more likely to be safe for people vulnerable to this virus.

But vaccinating the younger (<65 years old), healthy population with product based on a novel technology without any long-term safety data is reckless beyond words.

Whilst claiming it is safe (repeated by Sunak last week).

The concerns are growing:

- link with the development of myocarditis

- DNA contamination beyond acceptable levels

- Frameshifting with the potential of cells to produce different proteins

- mRNA found in placenta and umbilical cord

- Ineffectiveness

- unknown role of lipid nanoparticles

- multiple other reported side-effects

People are voting with their feet, however in my view these products should never have been used in the first place. But now they should be pulled off the market whilst we work out what is going on.

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The Great Crapestry of Covid's avatar

I'm actually sewing a 'frameshifting' panel just now!

I agree with what you say.

I actually remember in medical school in the mid 1990s a doctor telling us about what is now known as the contaminated blood scandal and implying that the problem had been hyped and most blood had been very safe. I now know people whose families have been devastated by the contaminated blood - if you heard their story it would move you to tears. They also experienced the stigma of Hep C and all it implied and that stigma was directed at them by health professionals too!

I also remember as a house officer being told that Vioxx had a better safety profile than NSAIDs and it was preferentially prescribed in our hospital.

I also remember being taught as a junior doctor that pain was the 5th vital sign, that opioids were not addictive when prescribed for pain and that everyone with chronic pain had a right not to be in pain, so we shouldn't worry about prescribing strong opioids and gabapentoids.

I also remember as a junior doctor in the noughties doing a gynae attachment for a consultant who did loads of transvaginal mesh procedures. It was our job as juniors to do the consent forms. There was no awareness of the potential for a minority of these women to experience life changing chronic intractable pain, so it was not mentioned on the consent procedure.

I also remember as a GP trainee the brief Tamiflu debacle and feeling like a complete mug afterwards. One of my mentors, a GP of considerable experience, saw through the whole thing at the time. It was a great learning experience.

This though is a whole different level.

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Myra's avatar

I agree fully.

It is however difficult to grasp the scale of problems these mRNA products bring. So much could still be subclinical and you won't find unless you look. And it is important to look.

But maybe it will all fizzle out as people stop taking these products.

Maybe the excess deaths are mostly due to the after effects of lockdowns in all shapes or forms.

Only time will tell I think, but this does not take away from the fact that these products should be halted pronto!

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The Great Crapestry of Covid's avatar

Yes if an autoimmune condition only manifests 6-12m or even longer after vaccination the link would most likely be overlooked. I worry about the frameshifting phenomenon, and the potential for amyloid. I keep an open mind. I suspect if it is seen it will simply be put down to the virus. We've seen how science works in the new normal.

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Roisin E Dargan-Peel's avatar

Future drugs/therapeutics are to be based on this mRNA technology (huge investments made in this) so I think it most unlikely that such a development will be halted. The UK Govt. appears to be totally committed to signing up to the WHO International Health 'Recommendations' (my quotation marks!). When (not if) the next 'pandemic' is announced, such is the corruption of WHO, I fear that we will have no right to bodily autonomy, no right to say 'no' and that we must all do our bit/extend our arms/swallow that pill, whatever, for the 'common good'.

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The Great Crapestry of Covid's avatar

I don't think that will happen (no right to bodily autonomy) - I think they really messed up badly over this even though they thought they were on a winning streak - forcing drugs on people is not a strategy for long term success. In 2021 they all got carried away but it is coming to bite them on the bum now. I'm hoping it leads to succesful lawsuits, especially over people harmed by mandates.

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Roisin E Dargan-Peel's avatar

A thorough analysis of the nonsense to which we were subjected as ordinary citizens going about our daily lives. Those of us who questioned 'the science' of hastily-brought-to market jabs and associated risks were 'othered' for the 'greater good'. We should have been publicly vaunted not denigrated. The world has turned upside down.

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The Great Crapestry of Covid's avatar

I agree and unfortunately it isn't going to go away - every week in the BMJ there is something reinforcing the old antivaxxer tropes and the dangers of vaccine hesitancy.

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Roisin E Dargan-Peel's avatar

Well, you know the saying 'one a lie is repeated often enough it becomes the truth' (or words to that effect). All we can do is to keep on countering the lies, no matter how exhausting, frustrating - someone, somewhere will wake up that wasn't before. It's clear the future is a bio-technocracy and that we must fight with every breath in our bodies. I think avenues will open, and are opening, to fight back against the direction we're being pushed into. We're in very dark times but I do believe we will come through.

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The Great Crapestry of Covid's avatar

I tried to submit a BMJ rapid response to the article 'Behavioural interventions to reduce vaccine hesitancy driven by misinformation on social media' (https://www.bmj.com/content/384/bmj-2023-076542), calling attention to the fact the organisations funding the grants for the research all have a vested interest in the advertising and sales of vaccines. So basically a vaccine industry-generated propaganda piece whereby doctors are yet again encouraged to correct wrongthink and see 'vaccine hesitancy' as an ever present danger that needs tackling.

I made two other points - First, that many of the early claims made for the novel coronavirus vaccines could now be re-categorised as misinformation and this in itself has probably done more to damage public trust in the reliability of governments and health institutions as sources of accurate information on vaccines, than all the stereotypical bad faith actors.

Secondly, when the public see the way vaccine injured people are subsequently treated by the drug companies and governments, no amount of social engineering and attempts at behavioural modification will work to 'correct' their impressions.

I got a positive response from the letters editor asking me to provide references to my quotations so that she could check them before posting my response. Oddly after that she completely ghosted me, ignoring 4 further emails and a re-submission of my response. It's funny that, because they are usually happy to publish other viewpoints, so perhaps I hit a raw nerve.

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Roisin E Dargan-Peel's avatar

It's worrying that responses are censored but not at all unsurprising, sadly. I completely agree with the points you made and in a sane world they would have been published. The corruption, however, goes deep and wide and Govt. is spending millions on how to better understand 'vax. hesitancy' when they already know too well the reasons. I received two requests from my GP surgery to fill in an on-line questionnaire regarding views on C-19 'vax' and vaccines in general. I have declined on both occasions to do so. I'm not contributing to Govt.'s warped agenda nor do I wish them to insult my intelligence. However, those of us 'in the know' (numbers increasing by the day hopefully), can only keep on raising awareness and pushing back as best we can.

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